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There is a disconnect here at redstate, and it has consequences.
By Oz Posted in 2008 — Comments (125) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »
There seems to be a disconnect here at Redstate between desires and realities.
This is not an attempt to get you to like McCain or to stop cricizing McCain or to turn your bumper stickers one way or another.
Let me give you a series of short observations:
1) At one point when I pitched an idea that everyone give $250 to McCain out of their stimulas package (around February), the idea was met with great excitement and even warranted me a front page promote (yeah, me!).
2) A follow up "reminder" blog a week or so ago brought me near universal scorn and a few "I'll give to someone else, but not McCain."
3) Read any post about Obama's ideas and you'll see the following types of comments: "Obama will be a disaster for America."
4) Even more fun is to say things like this (recently seen on confirmthem.com): "When President Obama fills these judicial vacancies, blah blah," which was followed by a quick retort about the fact that Obama will never be President.
There is a disconnect between those facts.
Come November, we are going to either read about:
President-elect McCain
or
President-elect Obama
There is one group of people who can make sure it's the former and not the latter.
Us.
Now, I really don't care if you hate McCain or like McCain or are only supporting him because you wish you were married to his wife.
If you DON'T want to wake up to a President Obama then it's going to take some MONEY for that to happen.
Money given to your favorite congress critter may be noble (depending on the critter), but it's NOT going to stop President Obama from taking office and replacing the old liberal fogies with new liberals and signing all those crazy bills that Bush has vetoed.
So if you are SERIOUS about not wanting a PRESIDENT OBAMA and you have the means to give to McCain, now is the time to do it.
You vote not only with your vote, but with your dollars.
I am not a McCain apologist. I hate his immigration position, his Go14 position, his mccain/feingold, etc, but that's hardly the point.
I am fearful for an America ruled by President Obama.
The stimulas package, for most of us, gives us access to some money we weren't expecting to have six months ago. I'd respectfully suggest that you give $100 to $250 to McCain.
My donation went out this morning right after the check from the government appeared on my bank statement.
Re McCain on Factor- he looked GREAT!
by streetwise
and he has a very down-to-earth persona, not preaching from Olympus like Obama.
We win either way
by rodguy911
rodguy911
HI Oz, good post,and of course you are right. Generally speaking when we go against our own party's candidate it is usually self defeating.
In most cases when you say things like McCain is incredibly weak on immigration/securing the border or plays the finger in the wind game and is just as likely to cave to any of the libs for any kind of percieved gain as not, generally it would be bad for our cause and good for the dems. But, not necessarily so in McCain's case.
The upside of McCain is that he pulls from middle of the roaders/indys and all 4 conservative dems still left out there.
The down side of McCain is that he is not conservative enough for many of us.
The truth is that every time we knock McCain down and make him look bad among fellow conservatives he looks better to indys and libs. Truth is we can't lose, and with a candidate like bama who will polarize huge segments of the entire voter base even McCain can win.
RG
Yes, McCain looked good on
by Flagstaff
Yes, McCain looked good on The Factor, but it was a terrible interview. His responses and his voice were weak, O'Reilly kept cutting him off or talking over his answers, and it appeared that some of the answers were edited. O'Reilly didn't help his own reputation as an interviewer, either. He doesn't listen, therefore his follow-up questions were off the mark.
As with the Hillary interview, I doubt that anybody was persuaded to change a vote.
"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it.“--Jeff Cooper. From Bill Coffey's collection of military quotations
Yes -- McCain looked good last night..
by M Penny
And Laura Ingraham looked beautiful -- stunningly beautiful. She should wear that color all the time.
What's more Laura hit on the exact issue where McCain once again but me back on my heels to wait.
His answer on sanctuary cities was not good. He should have said -- He would take action to end sanctuary cities. Period. End of Sentence. Next topic.
Nope -- he had to bring up CAIR -- which is just amnesty. O'Rielly did not ask you about immigration reform -- he asked about sanctuary cities not contacting ICE and turning over illegal aliens arrested for other crimes.
M Penny
Particularly if you're going to do it in a thread that points out the practical problems with bashing McCain.
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
touchy, touchy ---
by M Penny
alas, I am human, not perfect Mr. Lane; but, I can always hope for change -- oh wait that is the other guy.
Also, I didn't think that was a bash. I pointed out that instead of just answering the question asked -- he couched his answer in exactly the way that causes trouble with a large segment of not just the GOP base but the majority of voters.
I realize McCain is not an attorney, but he needs to answer the question asked. McCain could have given an answer that was perfectly acceptable to most people, including immigrants and illegal aliens -- "Yes, if an illegal alien is arrested for another crime they should be turned over to ICE."
M Penny
:ka-click: Hi, retread.
by Moe Lane
Let's clear something up. Coming back after you've been banned is typically automatic grounds for another, more comprehensive ban: you currently get to keep posting on this forum solely because I decided that you may have actually learned enough to play well with others. I reserve the right to change my mind about this at any time, too. So no cracking wise, no attitude, and Reply To This is your friend.
Pretty please, with sugar on top. 'Kay?
Moe
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
Moe - I'd love to chat with you
by M Penny
about all of this off line -- but you are not accepting e-mails.
M Penny
That is correct. <NT>
by Moe Lane
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
Moe -- I am mystified
by M Penny
I don't want to be obtuse, but exactly how have I broken the posting rules. I'm starting to feel more than a little intimidated. Maybe it is just a female thing. I would certainly hate to post anything with attitude. Is there one standard for men posting and another for women? Am I on double secret probation?
M Penny
I'm much more likely to ban a man than a woman. Not that there's any real way to tell on the Internet, of course.
I have a baby to feed dinner to, so let's just cut to the chase, here: you're here on sufferance, I'm being nice about it, and I don't really care about your opinion on the first two points. If you have a problem with that, email the Directors: I have no control over what they see.
Have a nice day.
Moe Lane
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
M Penny-
by c17wife
put your thoughts in the comments sectionof the contact form. Put Moe's name in the subject line. He'll get it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Just a typical, small town, white girl...
c17
by M Penny
on any thread or just like this.
I wanted to take the conversation off line.
M Penny
Use the contact form at the top. n/t
by c17wife
Just a typical, small town, white girl...
Moe, seriously,that was bashing? n/t
by c17wife
Just a typical, small town, white girl...
Yes. Quite mild, but yes.
by Moe Lane
Look, I don't expect that the people who are angry at the guy over immigration should just give up that anger, any more than they should expect me to give up mine over McCain-Feingold. But if I have to read it, it should at least be threaded properly.
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
us that might as well pack up our toys and lay down for naptime for the next 6 months.
Adam has been hyper-sensitive for 2 days now about most things we have brought up. Yet he wonders why some feel censored and eventually leave. Now I guess I have my answers.
This is a great pity as I have previewed some super secret stuff and it is all good, very good. But if basically making a statement of fact/opinion in a straightforward manner is bashing, I won't need RS 3.0.
I don't know who M Penny is or why she was banned the first time, but it does appear that we might be snacking on our own a little bit here.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Just a typical, small town, white girl...
FWIW
by Adam C
I didn't think it was bashing. It might be a threadjack. And if the poster is a retread, then I'm not sure why they are here, but the statement itself was not bashing in my opinion.
But that's a subjective thing.
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dang it
by Adam C
I have to kowalski here. I didn't see the "amnesty" claim. I think that's unfair b/c McCain has never supported amnesty. But that is truly a threadjack. I don't know that it's bashing. But it's definitely poking in the eye.
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Where did I say "Don't do that, c17wife?"
by Moe Lane
What I said was to at least thread it properly.
Moe Lane
PS: Now, if you're bothered by the fact that a site moderator is silently groaning every time people talk about how they won't support the C- guy on immigration (as opposed to either one of the two other candidates who are Fs on immigration), that's a different issue, but not really one that I'm more than peripherally involved in. :)
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
Moe -- if I may
by M Penny
I understand the moderators silently groaning when people say the won't support the C-guy guy ...
but I did not say that -- I said that McCain answered more on the question than benefited him. He could have answered the question asked and avoided stirring up the CAIR hornets nest.
Okay, I am sorry I clicked the wrong rely point --- again, I never claimed perfection. While I was a RS member since 2004, I did not get into posting until recently. As a Fredhead, I’ve taken a lot of personal insults on this site far worse than what banned me. No one was ever threatened to apologize or get banned. I realize you guys like to keep the RS operating at a stellar level, but gosh – you are pretty heavy handed with me.
Now I hope that isn't too much attitude.
M Penny
C17wife
by M Penny
I am a 49 year old female attorney/CPA who works in Washington DC and lives in Northern Virginia. I have worked in Republican campaigns for a number of years. I registered back on RS over three years ago as Judy T, but rarely posted. I spent time on other cites. In the past I didn't really have the time or inclination to do more than read. This year I volunteered for the Fred Thompson campaign. Late last year someone asked that I come post here on RS to help support Fred. So I did.
I actually took a week's vacation and went to work in South Carolina. I had a scheduling conflict that kept me from going to Iowa. All the same, after South Carolina I was banned for remarking on the sleaze factor from another candidate's campaign. That's it. One simple little question and poof. In a very heavy handed way I was told to apologize or be banned. Certainly you understand what it is to tell a woman to apologize when she feels she has done nothing wrong. (Beat the little woman down some more.)
However, when Obama's campaign started to take flight, I actually had content I wanted to post. I thought it was content that was ahead of the curve on the Reverend Wright/Black Liberation issue. So, I came back under a different name and posted. You've defended me back when I was called a troll -- and I thank you. I guess I am just suppose to be pretty, sit in the corner, agree with everything the guys say, and make the men feel comfortable.
M Penny
M Penny
by Just Plain Bill
Hang in there.
And Moe, you need to lighten up just a little bit.
It didn't look to me like a thread jack. I was able to tell what M Penny was responding to, and I thought her observation was spot on.
Sen. McCain has a habit of answering the wrong question, and he does it often enough that I wonder what his real message is.
And to C Adam, the Senator, in fact, supports amnesty. He just doen not want to call it that.
If that gets me banned, oh well.
This site is one of five that I click on multiple times a day, if that gets cut down to four, OK.
No, it just makes you wrong
by Adam C
Where did this "I'm gonna be banned, I'm being oppressed" mentality start. McCain never supported amnesty and he still doesn't. Reagan did. I'd consider it but probably prefer McCain's plan of penalties.
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million coupled with enforcement measures he never got a chance to enforce and McCain-Kennedy-Dubya's bill instantly legalizing twenty million + WITH KNOWLEDGE OF THE FAILURES OF THE REAGAN BILL BY 41 NA DSLICK WILLIE, with tepid penalties and easy "proofs" extending legalization.
close to a slander of Reagan
Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
"One man with courage makes a majority." - Andrew Jackson
let's review an example of Reagan's attitude regarding the rule of law
PATCO
nuff said
devine out
Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
"One man with courage makes a majority." - Andrew Jackson
has been known to produce sterling examples of conservative Reaganite republicans.
Just as elder's respect for gen x numbers crunchers was earned via knowing what oone is ignorant of.
Confucious-cock
Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
"One man with courage makes a majority." - Andrew Jackson
Adam C: "Where did
by Flagstaff
Adam C: "Where did this...mentality start"?
It's good that you ask. Here's a little story:
Thirty years ago, when I worked for Ford in Dearborn, there were occasional outbreaks of complaints by management at the various auto manufacturers about their employees who drove "competitors' vehicles" to work. I believe that at one time Chrysler banished other American vehicles to the furthest reaches of the parking lots, and excluded foreign autos in toto. It always seemed to me that management should have been a bit more introspective. After all, employees are given special prices on new car purchases. So why wasn't that enough to keep all their employees "loyal"? Management needed to recognize that they had a product problem, not an employee loyalty problem.
We unwashed bloggers here aren't just making this stuff up. Comments such as the ones you have just responded to are the result of the perception of the participants. Whether valid or not, I suspect that the perception is nurtured by actual instances of quick-trigger banishment, perhaps without adequate explanation to satisfy the innocent bystanders.
BTW, on a political note, some Democrats have wanted to call that free parking perk "untaxed employee income." If they couldn't raise the tax rate, they wanted to increase its base.
"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it.“--Jeff Cooper. From Bill Coffey's collection of military quotations
I'd be more sympathetic
by Adam C
if there was any evidence that people get banned for being wrong about McCain's stances on issues... or for being openly anti-McCain. We had a whole upside logo escapade and to my knowledge, no one got banned. Heck, ace still has the freaking anti-GOP logo in his signature and he's still here.
It's almost like the right has seen the success of the "I'm a victim, treat me special" view of much of the left. Ergo, it must strengthen their point if they say "If this gets me banned" before saying something. As if that makes the point stronger.
We ban Paulites, we ban lefties who disrupt things, we ban racists, we ban people who use bad language. But we have pretty darn high tolerance for conservatives of all stripes, even for disruptive behavior by those posters. I've defended this by saying that lefties/Paulites are in a visitor's home and you should be more respectful when you are a visitor than when it is your own house.
But if people can point to some people banned for arguments over these issues, I'd be happy to be corrected.
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Forest for the trees
by liandro
The mods set the tone of the site, and the tone of the site has often been hostile, combative, and all around unpleasant for many different groups of people, despite the fact they they/we are often working towards the same goals. If mods spent as much time trying to influence HOW things are said on the site (and leading by example works well...) instead of WHAT they say, I think everyone would win.
Disclaimers: This is addressing the question of why people feel oppressed by hair-trigger banning. And when I say "mods" I do mean "mods", not Adam C in particular (who along with blackhedd happens to be one of the big-wigs I read/pay attention to the most) or this thread in particular. Redstate has taken a very aggressive and what I believe to be a (as I argued in my only diary) counter-productive approach to dealing with things they don't like. That's a large part of why I mostly lurk and recommend.
Anyway, that's my two cents on why many feel they have to walk on eggshells at times. Take it or leave it.
lol
by liandro
fair enough! Although some people, and topics, can get away with a lot more then others. I hope they have an official FAQ of such things on RS3.0. Although in all honestly figuring out which topics are more precious or taboo to the mods/site takes a little time, FAQ or no.
M Penny, FWIW I like your style
by peg c
You've been called a troll, I've been called a Moby, and as far as I know neither is true. There is a heavy dose of overactive testosterone here, which usually doesn't bother me (I tend to avoid chick sites like the plague). And men think we get hormonal. Ha!
FredHead forever Peg
You may not be interested in war, but war is interested in you.
I don't get it either MPenny.
by c17wife
All I can tell you is to click the contact button at the top and let the directors know your thoughts. I've e-mailed one of them personally today.
This is craziness.
Meanwhile, Obama attended a King's Coronation on Capital Hill yesterday and one of his newly announced SD has publically declared he is the winner. My anxiety level is about topped out for tonite.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Just a typical, small town, white girl...
Laura Ingraham - the adult's Ann Coulter
by streetwise
She's not quite as witty as Ann, but she has more depth, is more personable, and she defends her positions like Scarlett O'Hara trying outwitting the Yankees at Tara.
And she looks GREAT, too!
she sure does....
by jdub19
" Got to love the Lord for making things like that."
Morally Compromised
I try over and over to listen to her...
by GordonTaylor
and I just can't make it through one show. Don't know why...
And, I can't read her books either. Have I got a problem?
Wasn't she on MSNBC panels sometimes?
___________________________
Need a better credit score?
A problem?
by bamapachyderm
I hope not, 'cause if you have a problem, I do too. I'm right there with you. (Don't even get me started on Coulter.)
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~ Beth ~
to the right what with all of the people who committed to give...I said I wouldn't and donated $25.00....so I hope to see that $50.00 over there light up!
Freedom of Religion not Freedom from Religion
True
by Adam C
I gave a while ago (pre-ticker), wish I had waited to be able to have my amount "count."
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bar Redstaters...........
Freedom of Religion not Freedom from Religion
I put in another $25
by Adam C
but don't tell my wife :)
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mum's the word :-)
by Jaded
Freedom of Religion not Freedom from Religion
Question on the ticker....
by Carol in Austin
I got over McCain not being perfect a long time ago, although I understand the raw emotions on both sides.
I have contributed $700 directly at the McCain website & will contribute more - up to the max. What is this slatecard thingy? Should I continue to contribute at McCain's website or is there a benefit to RedState for me to contribute through the slatecard?
Pardon my ingnorance about this; this is all new to me.
*Right* To The Source
by BigGator5
I stay with donating directly McCain's website. Not that I don't trust slatecard, but why go through a third party when you donate right to the source?
Carol
by Adam C
First, thank you for your generosity.
Second, slatecard is an online tool so individuals can make their own "slate" of candidates and fundraise with it. The one on the right column is a slate of RedState endorsed candidates. The link at the bottom of my comment is a list of Senate Candidates in close races.
Third, since RS started using slatecard, it would be good for the site if those numbers went up. If Rs can show it can raise thousands or tens of thousands of dollars for a house or senate candidate, then it gets kudos for being a good way to raise money. Kos raises in the hundreds of thousands for candidates.
So there is nothing in it for the campaign or you if you use click on the slatecard icon, but it lets RS flex its communal muscle.
Hope that clears it up.
______________________________________
Donate to the Rs in Close Senate Races through Slatecard
Sorry
by BigGator5
Didn't mean to trip on slatecard's toes.
I might donate using slatcard now.
No prob
by Adam C
If you use slatecard, make sure to go through the RedState slate (on the right column). I think generally using slatecard is good b/c it is shows a "right on the internet" presence. Just my 2 cents.
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Donate to the Rs in Close Senate Races through Slatecard
Thanks Adam,
by Carol in Austin
I will continue to contribute to McCain directly, but I will use the slatecard for other R races - the convenience sounds nice.
Although everyone's enthusiasm level is different, I hope we can all come together to support McCain. The thought of a President Obama scares the bajeebies out of me - and I've been voting for 30+ years.
Already Donated
by BigGator5
I have already donated. Some people have talked the talk, but I've walked the walk.
Thank you, Oz
by bamapachyderm
Teh Obamessiah has already spent over twice as much as McCain has RAISED altogether. We are WAY behind, and MUST catch up fast.
Why it matters: All that money Obama, the DNC, and their 527s have will be going to lie about McCain and divert attention from the very real problems they have with their candidate. We can run *some* ads, but they've got more than enough money to bury ours. They have GOTV money like you would not believe (to transport voters to the polls, among other things), and they reward their volunteers with free lunches and stuff courtesy of the Obama campaign.
Money matters. More than ever, this year.
------------
~ Beth ~
Gee Guys and Gals
by Michael Handley
I have been away for some time so I am not up to date. I do need to ask a question. Do I have to support all of McCain's positions to be acceptable here? This site was much more civilixed the last time I was reading it....
Nope
by Adam C
I don't speak for the site. But here's my two cents on how criticism of McCain can be productive and in tune with the purpose of this Republican site.
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Look, McCain's people are clueless.
by Section9
They believe, and they are being encouraged to believe by the Usual Suspects who run this place and other Leadership Elements of the Conservative Movement, that years of kicking the shins of your own party can be made up by picking a Movement Conservative as the VP. This is a complete joke, as the Movement Crowd totally misses the exhaustion that the electorate has with the Republicans.
People around here scratch their heads and wonder why there isn't the enthusiasm for John McCain that there is over in the Democratic ranks for Obama? That's bloody easy!
McCain has made his bed, and now he is going to lie in it. McCain gave us the Gang of 14, Amnesty, and the assault on the First Amendment known as Campaign Finance Reform. I will work and vote for the man because the alternative is far worse: McCain understands that the campaign in Iraq must be won before our troops can be brought home, and he is very nobly swimming against the tide of an electorate determined to elect Jimmy Carter, Part Deux. But his anemic campaign is a shadow of BushCheney2K and BC04 because the guy has bought MSM street cred by kicking his party in the shins. That Pioneer money ain't comin' in for a reason, folks.
John McCain won this year due to the hideously inept campaigns of his opponents. Had Mitt Romney been a halfway decent candidate, and been able to properly parry McCain's smear on the war, Romney would be the nominee, and we might be able to have a coherent (and winning) economic debate. As it was, Romney couldn't be Huckabuck who was busy hitting mailboxes with a baseball bat while eatin' Moon Pies.
I'm a Floridian. In a just world, Jeb Bush would be our nominee. As we are now aware, fair is for Girl Scouts. But I'll donate to the old guy. JMC means well, which is quite unlike the transparently dishonest prat and the posse of intellectual car battery thieves that he's running against.
There's a lesson in McCain for Conservatives: the Republican Party is all we've got. If McCain wins, then bully for us. But if the tide goes against him, one of the reasons will be that you can't spend your career tearing down what you're supposed to campaign with. There's another forum that has a rule: No Third Parties. It's a good rule. Our party is filled with people who get all Andrew Sullivan on us: "I'm taking my marbles and going to the Constitution Party or looking for the real conservative alternative!" (Democrats, by the way, are never this stupid. They are actually interested in winning election campaigns.) In Andrew's case, he ended up with Obama and does strange, notional gymnastics to pretend that Obama is a conservative.
Learn from this experience. Or, to put it another way, you never saw Jeb Bush tearing down his fellow Elephants, now did you?
"History will be kind to me, for I intend to write it"-Winston Churchill
You know, Section9, you make some outstanding points there but..
by Jeff Emanuel
....the tone and over-the-top nature of your post takes away from them.
You said so much right there that it's a shame the overall message will get lost due to that tone.
I like Jeb too...but
by SteveLA
Section9
A selection by McCain of any of the usual "movement" social conservatives as his VP choice is a pander, pure and simple. McCain may be conservative on many many issues like abortion, but when it comes to the social conservative movement, the scar tissue on both sides is pretty deep.
As to Jeb...can he legally change his name to Smith, or Jones or maybe Sanchez...please? Jeb would be a great VP and a great President maybe some day, but you have to be smoking some strong stuff to not realize that Bush is not exactly a great name to have after 7 years of his brother's administration. Not going to happen sadly, and I'm not even sure if Jeb wants to run. He had some family issues with his daughter, and probably is enjoying not having her and his family in public spotlight and making some money. It's the same reason why Tom Ridge is probably off the list.
No, I think McCain needs to balance his team as President Bush did with Cheney and go with someone with business experience say someone with perfect hair....did I mention that Mitt has really nice hair.
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Proud member of the Barry Goldwater wing of the party !
You Win best Line Of The Day
by swamp_yankee
"Huckabuck who was busy hitting mailboxes with a baseball bat while eatin' Moon Pies."
Nice rant, by the way
Thanks I think I had sympathy venting with that post
by Joliphant
5's all the way and yeah I will probably give the old guy some dough as well.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
his planned speech to the hate group La Raza and planned climate change-apalooza tour.
Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
"One man with courage makes a majority." - Andrew Jackson
Who else has done this?
by SteveLA
game
So Sam Brownback and Karl "The Brain" Rove has spoken to this group, do you condemn them equally or is your outrage selective ?
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Proud member of the Barry Goldwater wing of the party !
we see the blind spot in the architect's brain (Latinos - see also Bush and his Tex-Mex culture blindspot). McCain is a merging of the two blindspots/stupidities, all of which is wrapped in a possibly unknowing surrender to liberal templates.
Yes, SteveLA, and thanks for calling me out, ALL are cowards or stupid.
Which is why I lean ever more to the federalist/libertarian side or at least this:
Yes, it is critical that Obama not be president.
But it is more critical that we the people end obescience to the leftist playing field, the pc rules that turn logic and morality and clear thinking on its head.
We the People are the bosses, and this people called DeVine will not not call racism by its name!
thank you Steve
Despite my many disagreements with you, I respect you and your honest search for the truth.
Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
"One man with courage makes a majority." - Andrew Jackson
Stand by
by SteveLA
game
Standby, maybe McCain with have a Senorita Rosa moment...who knows.
If McCain goes before La Raza and chides them for their racist policies, and explains how they and their rhetoric makes those trying to work a fair and just solution to this problem of illegal immigration, including both sides of this particular ditch.
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Proud member of the Barry Goldwater wing of the party !
God I hope so....nt
by Jaded
Freedom of Religion not Freedom from Religion
called opponents of the comprehensive immigration bill, racist equivalents to irish need not apply.
not holding breath
Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
"One man with courage makes a majority." - Andrew Jackson
If Obama doesn't scare
by Menlo
If Obama doesn't scare people, his supporters should. It would be worth it to me just to upset them. They have motivated me more than either Obama, Wright, or any politician. This wave of delusion that has swept across so many people everywhere in the entire nation MUST be put to a halt.
I am pretty sure they are backing Obama
by Joliphant
Just to bother us n/t
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
...and it's obvious why. But don't worry, I won't tell anyone.
::secret handshake::
(Arackbay thanks you).
But Addison its already worked
by Joliphant
The economy is on the rebound. So thanks to the wealthy libs in the senate it looks like the poor but honest republicans have some extra coin to give to our guy.
I never thought the Democrats would undercut their political ambitions over principle.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
We are a selfless people...
by Addison
...imagine how much money those poor but honest Republicans will get if we get the presidency. Support Republicans, Vote Obama!
Selfless but economically illiterate
by Joliphant
Who wants the money if its worthless.
But I like the Slogan, Vote Obama he will do for our currency what Mugabe has done for Zimbabwe's.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
...do you see what you made me do? We were having so much fun. And now there's an actual serious debate threatening to infest this thread. Sigh.
Yes but as much as your side wants him on the ballot
by Joliphant
The President is not running for Re-election.
Now I know you don't consider yourself one of the lowly parts of your party that actually believes the slogans or god forbid spends time on line at the voting booth.
So could you explain this to me. Doesn't it bother you to be backing a man who has put forth campaign platforms of economically isolating the largest trading nation in the world ? And do you really think trade barriers will produce more jobs here ? Or do you think that negotiations run by a politically party that was bought and paid for the by the Red Chinese will help ?
Just asking I may have some similar ocular gaps but I haven't noticed them.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
...but that may be because I'm from the South and any reference to being "on line" confuses and infuriates me.
I don't think he's proposing isolating us. I agree with his stance that NAFTA should have labor and environmental regulations attached to it, though hopefully not ones reflexively formulated by people who think every overseas factory is a sweatshop, or every developing nation ought to have our level of concern over the environment. I don't think we benefit long or short-term from having economic isolationism on the one hand or a poisoned, asthmatic, resentful third world on the other.
The Chinese have, uh, "invested" in all sectors of our government and economy via our national debt and their dollar reserves. That seems a bigger issue -- if it's an issue -- than any support they have for the Democrats. Though last I remember I was being told by some on RedState that this didn't matter. Maybe I remember wrong. It's possible.
The more important question is, why are you threadjacking just to pin lowly ol' me to the mat over Obama?
I believe you brought Barry O into this
by Joliphant
As to the Nafta stand did you mean what he said to us or the Canadians ?
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
As an on-topic joke, Joliphant...
by Addison
...and as to your question, both. NAFTA is flawed, will perhaps be negotiated, but is not getting scrapped.
Taking this "discussion" you've ginned up so seriously and trying to corner me with the stuff can't possibly be satisfying for you, right?
NAFTA
by St. Louis Conservative
You're kidding yourself if you think Canada or Mexico will accept any kind of "re-negotiations", unless the terms are more favorable to them. Bear in mind that Canada and Mexico are two of our top three suppliers of oil and energy. NAFTA has been extremely good for us on the whole. This whole NAFTA bashing episode by Obama (and Hillary) is a joke, and just goes to show how the unions have the Democrats by the balls in this election. Even lefty papers like the NY Times and the WaPo took Obama to task over this.
“.....women and minorities hardest hit”
Thanks for saying that.
by Flagstaff
Thanks for saying that. It's true.
"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it.“--Jeff Cooper. From Bill Coffey's collection of military quotations
You bob an weave well
by Joliphant
But usually I like a punch thrown at least a little counterpunching.
I will just leave off with noting that you still haven't answered why you support a man who's stated economic policies could be called Cruzado the sequel vs Smoot Hawley part IX. You also haven't explained how we would get good negotiations with China (lets face we could have perfect negotiations with the rest and it wouldn't matter), when the Chinese have well and truly wormed their way into Democratic party since the Clinton years.
So its not satisfying the way a Ribeye grilled over applewood or mesquite is but it does kind of measure up for long week beer, pizza and whatever is on the HDTV satisfying.
P.S. Please note I do answer yours directly.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
I'm not bobbing and weaving...
by Addison
...so much as you're lilting around, following me, and bothering me after you overheard me talking. It's weird.
By that token your action would be shouting into a room
Now why was it you found Obama's economic policies supportable again ?
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
"There is a disco"
by birdmojo
I'm just saying that it's Friday night and I'm sitting here drinking and playing play money poker and listening to the Bee-Gees and the title of this post has disappointed me greatly.
Man is free at the moment he wishes to be. --Voltaire
Night Fever - nt
by gamecock
Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
"One man with courage makes a majority." - Andrew Jackson
Does the Floor light up with Redstate 3.0?...just askin'
by speciallist
n/t
When I am strutting it does - nt
by gamecock
Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
"One man with courage makes a majority." - Andrew Jackson
not be helping John McCain if he cannot get big business to support him...
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=anDWekGuCW8E&refer=w...
Freedom of Religion not Freedom from Religion
Public financing
by cwilson
Does it matter whether anybody gives a dime to Sen. McCain? Didn't he announce he was taking public financing? If so, then where does donated money GO, if he's barred from spending it on the campaign?
Seems like it would be MUCH better to donate to conservative CongressCritters and Senators, to halt the bleeding there -- and we're going to need SOMEBODY in DC to stand athwart President McCain's (or Obama's, or Clinton's, or DemocrateSaviorMarkTwo's) leftward lurches and yell stop...
Cwilson, primary vs. general
by Adam C
There are two parts of the campaign for funding purposes. All candidates are opting out of private financing for the primary, which continues until the Convention in September. If you donate money, do it to the primary fund and the campaign can use it between now and September.
It seems likely the campaign will take public funding ($84M) for the general election which is the two months from the Convention through the election.
That's not to say you shouldn't give to REP and SEN candidate you like more, but I hope that clears up why there is still fundraising going on and why it matters.
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Donate to the Rs in Close Senate Races through Slatecard
when you say we had better support Mr. Rino, because he is better than Democrat X. It will not fly anymore. If I think that I will get liberal, or big government solutions from both parties then I would rather the Democrats win and let them take the blame for it.
The scare tactics are many:
Scare (1) the supreme court - well, some of the most liberal members were appointed by Republicans, and if McCain faces a democrat congress he will probably have to put a moderate at best on the court.
Scare (2) the war - well, the Iraqi's seem to have turned the corner and I believe can protect themselves now. Besides, even Obama is talking about a sixteen month troop draw-down which would be two years from now, so I think that is about right, if they cannot handle themselves in two years they never can.
Scare (3) tax, spend and the economy. This is the weakest of the arguments. the Republicans have been absolutely horrible on this. Did you know that over the last fifty years the deficit has been much, much higher on average under Republicans than Democrats? It's true, you can look it up.
The Dems want to raise taxes and increase social spending, but they will be constrained by reality and a core of republicans and moderate democrats. Whereas a Republican president might be able to inflate the hell out of the deficit because republican legislators will be reluctant to fight him.
"Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty"
Kyle
Kyle
by Adam C
"This is the weakest of the arguments. the Republicans have been absolutely horrible on this."
I entirely agree. In fact, much of my support for McCain is because he has fought the Republicans on this stuff. He opposed the Medicare Drug Bribe, the Transportation Pork Bill, and the Energy Pork Bill. Along with Sens. Coburn and Demint, McCain has been one of a very few Rs to take this seriously. As far back as 2003 he said Congress was spending "like a drunken sailor."
His health care proposal is based on smaller government and more competition. His education views are more pro-school choice than any R President in history. He supports personal accounts in SS. His platform includes a freeze on discretionary spending for evaluation of programs to eliminate.
He's not perfect on these issues, but it's one area where he could pull the Rs in a more conservative direction against the status-quo embrace of Big Government ideas and policies.
As for House and Senate members, I think it's harder to know if they will be status quo or reformers. I think the CfG has a good track record of finding reformers, but some of them are also bomb throwers that make solid R districts competitive (like Sali in ID-01). But they did find Coburn and Demint and help get them through tough primaries in 2004.
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Donate to the Rs in Close Senate Races through Slatecard
I'll grant you that
by kyle8
He might hold the line on spending, but he might do it by raising taxes, after all, that is what he supported in the past.
On that issue he probably will be better than Bush, but that is not saying much.
"Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty"
Kyle
McCain raising taxes
by Adam C
I know past results don't predict the future, but McCain has never in 25 years in the House and Senate voted for a tax increase. If you think he has, please find me the vote. He opposed one or two of the Bush tax cuts (while proposing his own cu
I too am fearful of POTUS Obama
As an aside...anyone else think JMcCain looked differnt last night on "The Factor".... he looked better than normal.
" Got to love the Lord for making things like that."
Morally Compromised