At the debate, Obama on the ropes with Ayers
Barry compares Weather Underground terrorist to Senator Tom Coburn
By Mark Kilmer Posted in 2008 | Dem debate | Obama | terrorism — Comments (52) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »
I missed last night's Dem debate, but host George Stephanopoulos asked candidate Barack Obama about his tawdry relationship with domestic terrorist Bill Ayers of the Weather Underground, who conspired to destroy federal buildings in the 1970s then, decades later, expressed regret that he did not succeed.
The unexpected came when Stephanopoulos, under what he termed "the general theme of patriotism," asked Obama about "a gentleman named William Ayers. He was part of the Weather Underground in the 1970s. They bombed the Pentagon, the Capitol, and other buildings. He's never apologized for that."
According to the account given by Scott Whitlock at NewsBusters.org, Obama responded by comparing Ayers to Senator Tom Coburn (R-Oklahoma):
Obama’s response included stating that Ayers's actions happened when he was very young and asserted they weren’t relevant. Oddly, he went on to compare a man who was involved in bombings that killed people to his colleague, Republican Senator Tom Coburn from Oklahoma. Obama stated, “The fact is that I’m also friendly with Tom Coburn, one of the most conservative Republicans in the United States Senate, who during his campaign once said that it might be appropriate to apply the death penalty to those who carried out abortions.”
Read More below the fold. …
Whitlock also tells us that MSNBC sportscaster Keith Olbermann whined after the debate:
The real story of his debate may not be found where they found the answers, but where one of the moderators found his questions: Sean Hannity of Fox News, and separately a local New York right wing radio host [presumably Steve Malzberg], each insisting during interviews this week with George Stephanopoulos of ABC that he ask Senator Obama about his tenuous past link to 60s and 70s terrorist radical William Ayers. Tonight, Stephanopoulos did that.
If you cannot argue with the message, you report that you think the messenger, Hannity, has cooties. That's not very Murrow-esque, Keefums, but did you see the Yankees-Red Sox game last night? 'T was another high-scoring affair, you know.
Not just Steph;
Hillary blasted Barry well:
She also blasted Mr Obama for sitting on the board of a Chicago philanthropic group with links to William Ayers, a former member of the Weather Underground. In comments published, coincidentally, on September 11 2001, Mr Ayers was unrepentant about bombing the Pentagon and other US government buildings.
Mrs Clinton said: "If I'm not mistaken, that relationship with Mr. Ayers on this board continued after 9/11 and after his reported comments, which were deeply hurtful to people in New York and, I would hope, to every American, because they were published on 9/11, and he said that he was just sorry they hadn't done more."
In its main article on the Dem Debate, the Los Angeles Times mentions only "Obama's relationship with fellow Chicagoan William Ayers, the 1960s radical who is now an education professor at the University of Illinois." The paper mentioned nothing about bombing the Pentagon or Ayers' published regret that the plot failed.
The Washington Post did a bit better:
He was then asked about his association with William Ayers, a member of the Weather Underground, a radical group from the 1960s and '70s. Ayers was quoted after the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, as saying he did not regret setting bombs and that "we didn't do enough."
Obama said he does not have a close relationship with Ayers. "The notion that somehow as a consequence of me knowing somebody who engaged in detestable acts 40 years ago, when I was 8 years old, somehow reflects on me and my values doesn't make much sense," he said. He also noted that President Bill Clinton had pardoned members of the group.
Barry, it would be one thing if the Weather Underground had been a discussion group and Ayers disavowed those discussions and that philosophy, but we're talking about conspiracy to destroy federal buildings for which Ayers is entirely unapologetic. That speaks directly to your inability to discern a difference between an intellectual proposition and A is A reality and your willingness to embrace evil. It is a dangerous trait in the President of the United States, and it is why, though he will be the Democratic Party's nominee this year, he will not be elected President.
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At the debate, Obama on the ropes with Ayers 52 Comments (0 topical, 52 editorial, 0 hidden) Post a comment »
I just can't believe someone running for President could say that. Is there a transcript?
That clip was amazing.
Hillary really twisted the knife after Obama tried to dismiss his relationship with Ayers, and then Obama's subsequent mudsling at Bill Clinton just trashed both of them.
The best comment I have seen about last night's debate (from a HotAir commenter) - "They looked like a couple of chimpanzees throwing poo at each other."
....over the debate right now. One lunatic over there made a comment that, "President Barack should revoke ABC's broadcasting license". If that's not Stalinist I don't know what is. The general consensus over there is that the whole debate was a Rovian tactic that was orchestrated by Cheney and the VRWC. These people are insane.
Did I mention that I AM LOVING THIS?
“.....women and minorities hardest hit”
believe that the VRWC controls the MSM....I wish because man would watching the news be so much more enjoyable!
Freedom of Religion not Freedom from Religion
considering that when I checked over there after the Republican Youtube debate fiasco, they were all clucking about what a bunch of babies we were to be so worked up about it.
And if you recall, that Youtube debate controversy was due to questions being asked by Clinton campaign operatives posing as undecided voters- although I guess that description may loosely fit Stephanopolous in the Dem debate.
During the Republican debates, young conservatives on LittleGreenFootballs.com and other such blogs were furious that the media were asking very tough questions of the Republican candidates "while throwing softballs at Hillary and Obama."
And my answer to the conservatives then is the same as my answer to the Democrats now:
If you're candidate can't handle tough questions from an American reporter, then as President, he won't be able to handle even tougher questions from the leaders of Russia, Iran, etc. And if you make a gaffe THERE, you might actually start a war (cf. April Glaspie to Saddam on the eve of the Kuwait invasion).
when he equated Ayers with Sen. Coburn. Absolutely unbelievable. Although, we should not be surprised due to his past equation of his typical white grandmother to Rev. Wright. There seems to be a pattern....
What links all these responses together is moral equivalence: All forcefully stated beliefs are equally worthy of respect.
Whether it's Obama's grandma saying she's afraid of being mugged, or Reverend Wright damning America, or Senator Coburn being opposed to abortion, or Ayers preaching terrorist violence to overthrow the country, or Thomas Jefferson saying "All men are created equal," or Adolf Hitler saying "I am doing the work of the Lord in fighting the Jew."
Let's treat all these folks with equal respect!
The Republicans had their own joke of a debate with the You Tube debate. There is a difference between the You Tube debate and the ABC debate last night, though. The questions asked last night are legitimate in the sense that we learn about their past. We also learn about exactly what they meant when questioned on current gaffes that many voters find objectionable. The You Tube debate was full of unnecessary questions that have no bearing on the job of POTUS.
He keeps mentioning "oh, he did this 40 years ago" as if that makes it all irrelevant. McCain was being beaten and tortured 40 years ago; I wonder if Barry is friends with any of them. If so, I'm sure he'd think it was completely excused; after all, he was only 8 at the time.
about it only recently. This was not unknown to Obama. Frankly, Obama's claims of ignorance of his associates' anti-Americanism has grown tiresome. I will say, without equivocation, that Obama blatantly lied when he claimed ignorance about Wright's views and comments.
Further, to equate Coburn's proposed criminal sanction (which I find ridiculos, by the way)with actual acts--let alone terroristic acts--is asinine. This is how soft Marxists think, though: if you say or think something out of the mainstream, in their world, it is the same as bombing, maiming and killing.
Obama gets into the most trouble when he accidentally says what he believes. This includes a reference to a baby carried by an unwed mother as a burden, let alone dismissal of working class people as "bitter."
The mainstream press did Obama no favor when it gave him a free ride for almost a year. Confronted with questions that will pale in comparison with those he would face as nominee, Obama melted down. This man is not ready for primetime, and one has to wonder what would have happened in Illinois if Obama had faced a substantive Republican opponent.
seven years ago after 9/11. By the way, Senator Obama, you do not pick your fellow Senators, you know, the people you need to work with to get things done. You do get to choose where you hold fundraisers, though.
I watched the debate last night and my impression was a bit different from some of the posters here. When Stephy asked Obama about Ayers, I thought Obama answered pretty well. He basically said that this guilt by association thing is rediculous. He was 8-years-old when Ayers was involved in the Weathermen, and the implication that Obama supports terrorism because he lives in the same neighborhood as Ayers, and served on a non-profit board that Ayers also served upon, is simply ludicrous. As a means of pointing out the silliness of this type of guilt by tenuous association he asked if he should have to appologize for having a friendship with Tom Coburn because of his views on abortion. Personally, I thought Obama made a very persuasive arguement.
When the moderates asked for Hillary's opinion on the matter she went on the attack. She immediately began trying to smear Obama with guilt by association, as if she had not heard a word Obama just said. My impression of her was that she was mean, petty, and not too bright for launching the attack.
Then Obama points out that Hillary herself has a far stronger link to the terrorist Weathermen, because her husband pardoned two of their members. My impression was that Obama's response here was a slam dunk. I thought Hillary was completely destroyed at this point in the debate, and that this exchange was the defining moment in the debate.
That's just my impression for whatever its worth.
______________________________
"The truth is not for all men, but only for those who seek it."
-Ayn Rand
Even lefty Obama supporters are furious at ABC because they think they damaged Obama last night, and they did. I thought Obama looked absolutely terrible. If he doesn't have a teleprompter in front of him he looks like a deer in the headlights. Plus, he lied again about not supporting a ban on handguns, and he danced around the question on Rev Wright.
Comparing William Ayers to Tom Coburn is ridiculous too. I can't really see how comparing an admitted, unrepentent communist terrorist to Tom Coburn is "a good answer".
“.....women and minorities hardest hit”
I just watched the clip, and while as a conservative, the question highlighting that Obama at a minimum is comfortable being pals with a scumbag like Ayers lowered my already low opinion of Obama, I have to say-
Imagining if I was a Dem watching this exchange, I would probably be ok with Obama's answer, but I would be livid at Clinton- total phony and totally insincere whining about how New York is "wounded" by Obama being friends with this idiot, and the pinnacle of insincerity- "I'm not saying this is an issue, I'm just saying the Republicans will make it one."
It will be interesting to see what happens to the poll numbers after this debate.
He minimized the relationship, but he was lying. Ayers helped introduce Obama into the Chicago political scene. Ayers is unrepentant over his terrorism, only wishing he could have been more successful at it.
"Not someone I regularly share ideas with...."
is different from
"We don't talk about politics and he does not influence me."
Guess which one Obama said?
--
Gone 2500 years, still not PC.
HRC has nothing to do with decisions made by then POTUS Bill Clinton.
BHO has everything to do with HIS OWN decisions to associate with people like Rev Wright, Bill Ayers, Tony Rezko, and so on.
For those decisions, BHO will and needs to be judged by the American people.
This isn't hard math...
" Got to love the Lord for making things like that."
Morally Compromised
" Got to love the Lord for making things like that."
Morally Compromised
The Wicked Witch was there for a lot of those policy discussions. Thats why Al Gore whined so much, because it was a co presidency then with Hillary and Slick Willy, and he had no pull. Not to mention how reported it was that Bill consulted with her about every move he made in the White House (well not every move he made-I'm sure he didn't tell her about those visits to the cigar shop) and the most important decisions went through her. Not that this excuses Barry O-the only good association he has is as a Sox fan-woohoo you know I had to get that in, best record in the AL my friend :-).
"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice.Let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue."-Barry Goldwater
Rudy/Romney for VP-because someone's got to punch the hippies.
this is going to be a loooooooong season!! :)
" Got to love the Lord for making things like that."
Morally Compromised
Wouldn't that be amazing? Come on-is there really anyone you'd rather play in the World Series than us?? It would be great for the city, and New York got their in 2000, I think we could honestly do it. Not to mention the trashing talking that we'd do on even more of a consistent basis. Although it would put all the pressure on the Cubs to get there.
"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice.Let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue."-Barry Goldwater
Rudy/Romney for VP-because someone's got to punch the hippies.
" Got to love the Lord for making things like that."
Morally Compromised
I watched the debate while walking on a treadmill. Wincing at the various things that Senators Clinton & Obama said, I was doing pretty good at turning their effect on my blood pressure to good use. Then came the question about terrorist William Ayers and Sen. Obama's obviously scripted answer comparing his relationship with Ayers to his relationship with Sen. Coburn. I was so shocked and appalled that I missed a step and darn near fell off the treadmill. It was such a slimy, gratuitous thing to say that it seemed incomprehnsible he actually said it.
Sen. Coburn's position on abortion differs markedly from mine, but his philosophical musings about the applicability of the death penalty in no way compare to William Ayers planting bombs and bragging about it years later lamenting he didn't plant enough. Sen. Coburn is a medical doctor who has spent his life helping people. He's an honorable man who stands by his positions and isn't serving in Congress for any reason other to advance his principles. He wasn't advocating murdering people who just turned up for work. Sen. Obama's comparison of the two was illogical, insulting, and tactically foolish. I can't believe that this crack will go over well with the voters Sen. Obama seeks to win over.
It stuns me to realize that I'm rooting for Hillary Clinton to win my state's primary. I wouldn't temporarily change teams to vote for her so I'll be voting for Sen. McCain. However, I hope she clobbers Sen. Obama next Tuesday.
Coburn should come out and demand a public apology from Obama and threaten a defamation lawsuit if he doesn't.
Ask not what I can do for my country, ask what my country can do for me. Washington Elected Elite
that get some neck hairs up? I too am sick of our side being scared to death to confront these leftist scum out of fear of losing a vote...
TRM
The Anti-Lib
I don't think Coburn should threaten a lawsuit (that would get everybody off on a tangent debating the merits of the suit).
But he should certainly call a press conference and demand an apology for being put on the same moral plane as a self-described terrorist. That would call more attention to Obama's remark for the benefit those Americans who hadn't paid attention to the debate.
Just another nail in the campaign coffin for Barry, but how can the DNC not give it to him? Wouldn't Al rally the troops and get ta marchin?
So the unhinged who agree with Ayers/Wright/Obama will remain aligned behind him and the remaining sane 90% percent of America will walk away...
The Dems have lost before they got started,,, I just hope McCain doesn't screw it up... I really, really, really hope he doesn't screw it up, I guess we are going to be stuck with global warming hooey and illegal invader amnesty as punishment for winning
TRM
The Anti-Lib
Is it possible that you could have twisted this any better?
For the record lets first understand Senator Obama's "relationship" with Bill Ayers.
1. Obama attended a 'greet the candidate' function at Bill Ayers house in 1995 when he was running for the Illinois State Senate in the district where Ayers lived.
2. Ayers donated $200 to Obama's State Senate campaign in 2002.
3. Obama and Ayers both served on the board of the Woods Fund of Chicago, a anti-poverty philanthropic foundation.
That folks is the extent of their "relationship".
It's not my intention to try and defend Dr. Ayers. However lets cover a couple of facts. First Bill Ayers has never been convicted of any crime having to do with the Weather Underground. Second whether you agree with his politics or not he and his wife have been model citizens since they both surrendered to authorities in 1980. As for his "no regrets" statement Bill Ayers has written:
"I'm often quoted saying that I have "no regrets." This is not true. I'm sometimes asked if I regret anything I did to oppose the war in Viet Nam, and I say "no I don't regret anything I did to try to stop the slaughter of millions of human beings by my own government." Sometimes I add, "I don't think I did enough." This is then elided: he has no regrets for setting bombs and thinks there should be more bombings."
Which of course is exactly what you did in your blog.
It takes what can only be an intentional misreading of Senator Obama's comment to try and suggest that he was "comparing" Senator Coburn to Bill Ayers.
What Senator Obama said was:
"This is a guy who lives in my neighborhood, who's a professor of English in Chicago, who I know and who I have not received some official endorsement from. He's not somebody who I exchange ideas from on a regular basis.
And the notion that somehow as a consequence of me knowing somebody who engaged in detestable acts 40 years ago when I was 8 years old, somehow reflects on me and my values, doesn't make much sense, George.
The fact is, is that I'm also friendly with Tom Coburn, one of the most conservative Republicans in the United States Senate, who during his campaign once said that it might be appropriate to apply the death penalty to those who carried out abortions.
Do I need to apologize for Mr. Coburn's statements? Because I certainly don't agree with those either.
So this kind of game, in which anybody who I know, regardless of how flimsy the relationship is, is somehow -- somehow their ideas could be attributed to me -- I think the American people are smarter than that. They're not going to suggest somehow that that is reflective of my views, because it obviously isn't."
Pretty straightforward response.
1. Both people are someone I know.
2. Both people have said things I don't agree with.
3. It's in no way logical for those things to be reflective of my views just because I happen to know those people.
...American servicemen and their dates at Fort Dix. Well, not really.
Sparky, don't apologize for domestic terrorists again here - even ones as inept as Ayers. And don't emulate your guy and compare a domestic terrorist to a sitting United States Senator, either.
You will now say "Yes, Moe" and leave this thread.
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
Actually Moe I think I'll respectfully suggest that you take your sanctimonious pontifications and stick them in your ear.
As I said I am not trying to defend Ayers. The reality however is that if the Government had been able to prove the conspiracy charge that you accurately describe then they would have tried him and his wife in court and they would be sitting in prison right now instead of Hyde Park.
Am I to conclude that you actually agree with the position taken by the "sitting United States Senator?" Just one man's opinion but that in my view puts you in a similar catagory to nut jobs like Bill Ayers.
illegal wiretaps that were not admissable in court which is how the terrorist is running free today......good gracious at least check something out before you speak....the man admits his wrong doing in his book....who you going to believe yourself or the terrorist who wrote a book?
Freedom of Religion not Freedom from Religion
But to answer your question:
If one believes that abortion is murder (as I do and many others on this site) then the logical conclusion should be that the practitioner should be charged with murder. Absent the Roe v Wade decision, it would be in many states.
Now also found at The Minority Report
...is that it's pretty much going to be impossible to do that and avoid charging the girl having the abortion with murder, too. And I'm of the opinion that the populace is not going to be happy with doing that, starting with myself.
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
I'm honestly not sure what the correct punishment would be. Just punching holes in the now-gone goon's argument.
And I would say, that once Roe is gone that I would see some states enact legislation as such. As an advocate of federalism, I find that an acceptable solution.
I am of course making the assumption that some day we can get Roe turned on it's head for the bad ruling that it was.
Now also found at The Minority Report
If it’s murder then its certainly 1st degree, pre - meditated or special circumstances whatever the state designation is. I don’t see any will for that in the public.
But if abortion is not murder then what is it? Just killing? I don't know the answer here. I just want Roe gone.
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Ta, apologist.
Moe
PS: Do site oppo research next time before you try to passive aggressive the site moderator who's also the most socially liberal, Sparky.
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
[...15 seconds to replace with something more interesting from Youtube. I love retreads. - Moe Lane]
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
Are you referring to the original comment or the video that you replaced it with.
Original comment: I actually don't remember, but I think my post tells you what I thought about it
Your video: Eh, it made me a little dizzy with the picture constantly rotating. But it contained more useful substance.
Now also found at The Minority Report
...to Coburn, but they're the same anyway. Got it.
1. Obama attended a 'greet the candidate' function at Bill Ayers house in 1995 when he was running for the Illinois State Senate in the district where Ayers lived.
"Attended"? He was the candidate in question, not a party goer.
Ayers plotted to blow things up to make a statement, and he wishes he'd done more. He's still that guy, and he started Obama's career in politics.
What part of "terrorist" don't you understand?
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Gone 2500 years, still not PC.
mean he saw the debate knows Obama is going to lose and wants to get out of the country because there will be no pardon forthcoming ;-)
http://blogs.suntimes.com/rezko/2008/04/rezko_trial_rezko_asks_to_get.ht...
Freedom of Religion not Freedom from Religion
Senator Obama, I would hope you're more patriotic than Pastor Wright.
The Jedi Mind skills of Senator Obama were in full effect last night. Every question about his character and associations is a distraction from the other part of the job interview. I’m sorry, but running for President not only requires a process of communicating your vision for the country. The other part of the interview is a test of your character and past. I’m sick and tired of Senator Obama wanting to skip the character part of the job interview because he feels it’s a distraction from the other part.